Is CAC Influenced by the Date of PCGS/NGC Certification? — Welcome to the CAC Educational Forum

Is CAC Influenced by the Date of PCGS/NGC Certification?

CAC can roughly determine when PCGS and NGC coins have been certified, using the slab designs and serial numbers as a reference. Is CAC beaning subliminally influenced by these approximate years of certification, given the continuously changing grading (and doctoring) standards? I believe that CAC and everyone else is so unconsciously biased, but I am not a TPG grader and thus solicit their input.

pcgs.com/holdermuseum

ngccoin.com/about/evolution-of-ngc-holder

Comments

  • Soliciting input from graders about something that you believe they are doing subliminally seems unproductive given that subliminal is defined as being below the threshold where a person would be consciously aware that they were being influenced.
  • Soliciting input from graders about something that you believe they are doing subliminally seems unproductive given that subliminal is defined as being below the threshold where a person would be consciously aware that they were being influenced.

    I was soliciting input from PCGS and NGC graders, not CAC graders.
  • I doubt they’re influenced in that way. Lots of people talk about grading being tighter or looser during certain time periods. But it’s far more important to keep in mind that with the volume of coins graded, many of them are over-graded and under-graded every day. It makes far more sense to focus on the coins, not when they were graded.
  • CACfan said:

    Soliciting input from graders about something that you believe they are doing subliminally seems unproductive given that subliminal is defined as being below the threshold where a person would be consciously aware that they were being influenced.

    I was soliciting input from PCGS and NGC graders, not CAC graders.
    Ahh, apologies.
  • MarkFeld said:

    I doubt they’re influenced in that way. Lots of people talk about grading being tighter or looser during certain time periods. But it’s far more important to keep in mind that with the volume of coins graded, many of them are over-graded and under-graded every day. It makes far more sense to focus on the coins, not when they were graded.

    You would know better than anyone, being an ex-NGC grader and thus a true expert. I am probably imagining things, but I would still swear that CAC is more liberal with old slabs.
  • CACfan said:

    MarkFeld said:

    I doubt they’re influenced in that way. Lots of people talk about grading being tighter or looser during certain time periods. But it’s far more important to keep in mind that with the volume of coins graded, many of them are over-graded and under-graded every day. It makes far more sense to focus on the coins, not when they were graded.

    You would know better than anyone, being an ex-NGC grader and thus a true expert. I am probably imagining things, but I would still swear that CAC is more liberal with old slabs.
    Are you saying that you think CAC’s more likely to sticker a higher percentage of undeserving coins in older holders than in newer ones?
  • MarkFeld said:

    CACfan said:

    MarkFeld said:

    I doubt they’re influenced in that way. Lots of people talk about grading being tighter or looser during certain time periods. But it’s far more important to keep in mind that with the volume of coins graded, many of them are over-graded and under-graded every day. It makes far more sense to focus on the coins, not when they were graded.

    You would know better than anyone, being an ex-NGC grader and thus a true expert. I am probably imagining things, but I would still swear that CAC is more liberal with old slabs.
    Are you saying that you think CAC’s more likely to sticker a higher percentage of undeserving coins in older holders than in newer ones?
    No, I think that most of the old slab coins deserve the beans. But I think that CAC is harsher on coins in newer slabs, almost to the point of being paranoid. I believe that CAC is justifiably suspicious of the (sometimes more liberal) newer grading standards, especially over the the last decade or so, which may just be a result of inexperienced graders' mistakes. But again, I am not an ex-NGC grader like you are and thus not an expert.
  • As noted, who really knows about subliminal effects?

    Regarding the above points made about CAC, there are tens of thousands of recently graded coins (high cert numbers) that have CAC stickers.

    But here’s my theoretical question - keeping in mind when the TPG first grades a coin, it’s raw, and we sense from PCGS public data that the percentage of coins given plus grades is apparently quite low. When a coin with a CAC is sent back via Reconsideration, this is now the first time that the TPG sees the coin now has the CAC sticker. Does THAT create a subliminal bias towards helping the coin get an upgrade? I don’t know.

    If indeed the coin does get an upgrade, even one that was recently graded, it can easily be argued that the coin might be high end. Separately, presumably mainly high end coins are getting sent back in via Reconsideration, hence the upgrade.

    It does make one wonder!

    Steve
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